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hF /MEng /makOtO

F TiN HAt a konsonAnts fOkust n indekst dikSunXI wUd bI a gUd
FdIa fP /SYvIan.
mF OnlI eksepSun wUd bI wxdz HAt stRt wiT a vQal.
unles, H wxd bigan wiT a vQal, you kUd Just diskRd Yl H vQalz and
Just indeks H wxd MziN H konsonAnt letxz.
it wUd alimenEt sum ekstrEnIas aksent difDensaz.

rigRdz, / pYl /vI.
pI. es. Az t H Alfabet PdD, HAt iz an uHD kwestjun.
___________________atAct___________________________
--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "MEng makOtO" <ljptbgx@...>
wrote:
> hQ t AlfabetFz jMziN :
>
> t fFnd a wurd HAt sQndz lFk "pESent"
>
> 1. sQnd it Qt.........................pE-Sunt
>
> 2. Omit H vQelz.....................p S nt
>
> 3. lUk up wot iz left............pSnt - pESent - Ebel t endur, sik
> person.
>

re: JEl

devOtiN jUr lFf t promOtiN pIs somtFmz rekwFrz spendiN som tFm in JEl.

hir iz wun elderli wUmAnz ekspiriens:

"duriN mF pilgrimaJ TrM /arizOna F woz arested bF a plEnklOTz polIsmAn
wFl mEliN leterz At H lOkal pOst ofis in /benson. After a SOrt rFd in a
pAtrOl kyr F woz bUkd Az a vEgrAnt. wen jM wYk on fET jM yr teknikli
gilti v vEgrAnsi. jes, F'v ben JEld several tFmz fOr not hAviN Ani moni,
but HE YlwEz relIs mI wuns HE understAnd.

"Her iz a grEt dIl v diferens betwIn a prizon n a JEl. a prizon iz
somTiN big HAt mEntEnz som kFnd v stAndardz. a JEl iz a litel afEr HAt
duzn't mEntEn muc v Ani stAndard. n His woz a JEl!

"HE put mI intM a hjMJ iner rMm surQnded bF sel bloks in wic HE lokd H
wimen, 4 t a sel fOr H nFt. Az F wYkd in F sed t mFself, 'pIs pilgrim,
jM hAv dedikEted jUr lFf t servis--behOld jUr wonderful nM fIld v
servis!'

"wen F wYkd in wun v H girlz sed, 'JI, jUr a funi wun, jUr H Onli wun
HAt kEm in smFliN. mOst v Hem kom in krFiN or kursiN.'

"F sed t Hem, 'supOz jM hAd a dE Yf At hOm--wUdent jM dM somTiN worTwFl
on HAt dE?' HE sed, 'jes, wot wil wI dM?' sO F got Hem t siN soNz HAt
lifted H spirit. F gEv Hem a simpel ekzersFz wic mEks jM fIl tiNgli Yl
Over.

Hen F tYkd t Hem abQt H steps tuward iner pIs. F tOld Hem HE livd in a
komjMniti n wot kUd bI dun in An Qter komjMniti kUd YlsO bI dun in Her
komjMniti. HE wer interested n Askd mAni kwesconz. O, it woz a bjMtiful
dE.

"At H end v H dE HE cEnJd mEtronz. H girlz dident lFk H wUmAn hM kEm in.
HE sed SI woz a hOribel person n sed not t Iven spIk t her. but F nO
Herz gUd in everibodi n v kOrs F spOk t her. F lernd His wUmAn woz
supOrtiN her cildren wiH His Job. SI felt SI hAd t work n dident YlwEz
fIl wel n HAt iz wF SI woz a bit kros At tFmz. Her iz a rIzon fOr
everiTiN.

"F Askd H mEtron t viZjMalFz Onli H gUd in H inmEts. n F Askd H girlz t
viZjMalFz Onli H gUd in H belIgerd mEtron.

" 'F rIalFz jM hAv a ful hQs hir n F kAn slIp komfortabli on His wUden
benc.' insted Si hAd Hem briN mI a kot wiH klIn bedklOHz, n F hAd a warm
SQer wiH a klIn tQel n Yl H komforts v hOm.

"in H mOrniN F bAd fErwel t mF frendz n woz eskOrted bF a lOkal depjMti
t H kOrthQs several bloks awE. F wozent hAndkufd nOr woz hI Iven hOldiN
on t mI. but hI hAd a grEt big gun At hiz sFd, n sO F lUkd At him n sed,
'if F wer t run awE, wUd jM SMt mI?' 'O, nO,' hI sed, griniN, 'F never
SMt AniTiN F kAn kAc!'

"in kOrt HAt mOrniN F plIded not gilti n mF kEs woz imIdiatli dismisd.

in mF personal efekts wic wer tEken OvernFt woz a leter wic hAd grEt wEt
in mF relIs. it red: 'H bErer v His nOt hAz FdentifFd herself Az a pIs
pilgrim wYkiN kOst t kOst t direkt H AtenSon v Qr sitizenz t her dezFr
for pIs in H world. wI dM not nO her personali Az SI iz Just pAsiN TrM
Qr stEt, but sins undQtedli it wil bI a loN hyrd trip fOr her, wI wiS
her sEf pAsaJ.' it woz on ofiSial stESonari n sFnd bF H governOr v H
stEt, /hQward pFl.

"wen F woz bIiN relIsd a kOrt ofiser remyrkd, 'jM dOnt sIm t bI Ani H
wurs fOr jUr dE in JEl.' F sed, 'jM kAn imprizon mF bodi, but not mF
spirit.' its Onli H bodi HE kAn put behFnd byrz. F never felt in prizon
n nIHer wil jM ever fIl in prizon--unles jM imprizon jUrself.

"HE tUk mI t H spot wEr F hAd ben pikd up H dE befOr. it woz a bjMtiful
ekspiriens.

"everi ekspiriens iz wot jM mEk it n it servz a purpos. it mFt inspFr
jM, it mFt edjMkEt jM, Or it mFt kom t giv jM a cAns t bI v servis in
som wE."

--pIs pilgrim

..........................................

9lJ

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Sun May 28, 2006 2:38 pm
Subject: fEljUr ??

r.teklund <http://profiles.yahoo.com/r%2Eteklund>

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? wot ekspiriens hAv jM hAd wiH fEljUr?

n wot leson did jM lern from it?

||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||





mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm\
mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm



F TiNk HOz 4 wer H Onli /rOmAn

leterz in wot F rOt. in HOz leterz it iz mF Akademik degrI--mAster v
eNgliS. hQever, it iz YlsO mF given nEm-- (meN).

hir iz a web pEJ [ www.phonicspeller.com ] HAt furHer eksplEnz a fonetik
dikSonEri dezFnd fOr HOz hM kAn pronQns a word but hAv nO FdIa hQ it iz
speld in fOren eNgliS--wordz lFk "nmn" (nemOnia)-- n wUd never TiNk t
lUk fOr it under H leter \p\.

mOst v us lernd fOren eNgliS in 1st grEd. F hAv nO trubel rIdiN it
sFlentli, but F YlmOst never rFt it. F rFt fonetikli weHer jMziN /rOmAn
leterz wiH kAps fOr H loN vQelz plus 10 stAdard ligacurz wic giv mI abQt
39 fOnImz.

HIz 40 leters HAt broHer /rId krIEted F konsider nirli perfekt fOr
fonetik eNgliS. nQ F Am trFiN t get broHer /gEts t aplF Hem t H
/mFkrOsoft nErESon prOgrAm. kompjMterz stil fFnd it difikult t pronQns
fOren eNgliS.

kompMterz jMz loJik n H mOr HAn 200 lANgwaJez HAt mEk up H dikSonEri
entrIz yr nirli 100% kEos.

F kAn not imAJin fOren eNgliS speliN ever acIviN H stAtis v a world
lANgwaJ.

m. m.

________________________________



Picture this:

A young student hears the word "awry" which happens to be unfamiliar and
wonders if it means what he or she thinks it means.

So, wanting to settle the matter once and for all, the student tries to
look up "awry" in a dictionary and after a long search, is unable to do
so.

Discouragement is likely to follow with perhaps these thoughts or
thoughts similar to them: "Why did I waste my time?" or "Why am I'm so
stupid?" or "Will I ever be competent in English?" etc.

______

Below you'll find a solution to this age-old situation which the English
language–without malice–constantly springs upon its learners and
users.

-- www.phonicspeller.com

Thanks, Ethan. That one's on my To Do list. What's happening is that
the CMU dictionary has entries for single Roman letters and pronounces
them as if you were reciting the alphabet, ay, bee, see, dee, etc. The
Filleter treats an apostrophe as a word break (to account for
possessive NOUN + 's) so it looks at the two word parts and tries to
pronounce the last bit as a word in its own right. I think the best
way around this is for it to have a special list of exceptional words
containing apostrophes, which are treated as single words rather than
two words with an intervening apostrophe.

LG

--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, Ethan <ethanl@...> wrote:

> Thanks, LG!
>
> I did notice something that was present in the last version, and is
> still present though with slightly different effects... words with
> apostrophes are mangled, because the apostrophe is treated like a word
> break.
>
> I ran this list of contractions through the fileter:
> aren't you've can't you'll couldn't you'd didn't he's doesn't he'll
> don't he'd she's hasn't she'll hadn't she'd isn't it's shouldn't
> it'll weren't we're won't we've wouldn't we'll I'm we'd I've they've
I'll
> they'll I'd they'd you're
>
> The results are:
>
> yran'tI jM'vI kAnt jM'[?] [?]'tI jM'dI [?]'tI hI'es [?]'tI hI'[?]
> dOn hI'dI SI'es [?]'tI SI'[?] [?]'tI SI'dI [?]'tI it'es [?]'tI
> it'[?] [?]'tI wI'rE wOnt wI'vI [?]'tI wI'[?] F'em wI'dI F'vI HE'vI F'[?]
> HE'[?] F'dI HE'dI jM'rE
>
> --
>
> Ethan
>
> Have you ever wondered what it'd be like to fly like a bird? Wonder
no longer! www.maximumride.com
>

Lionel Ghoti wrote:

>Thanks, Ethan. That one's on my To Do list. What's happening is that
>the CMU dictionary has entries for single Roman letters and pronounces
>them as if you were reciting the alphabet, ay, bee, see, dee, etc. The
>Filleter treats an apostrophe as a word break (to account for
>possessive NOUN + 's) so it looks at the two word parts and tries to
>pronounce the last bit as a word in its own right. I think the best
>way around this is for it to have a special list of exceptional words
>containing apostrophes, which are treated as single words rather than
>two words with an intervening apostrophe.
>
>LG
>
>
That would probably take care of the problem, then. There aren't really
that many contractions in English, they just get used a lot! Put them
all in as exceptions, and it should work just fine.

--
Ethan

Have you ever wondered what it'd be like to fly like a bird? Wonder no longer! www.maximumride.com

F TiNk HOz 4 wer H Onli /rOmAn

leterz in wot F rOt. in HOz leterz it iz mF Akademik degrI--mAster v
eNgliS. hQever, it iz YlsO mF given nEm-- (meN).

hir iz a web pEJ [ www.phonicspeller.com ] HAt furHer eksplEnz a fonetik
dikSonEri dezFnd fOr HOz hM kAn pronQns a word but hAv nO FdIa hQ it iz
speld in fOren eNgliS--wordz lFk "nmn" (nemOnia)-- n wUd never TiNk t
lUk fOr it under H leter \p\.

mOst v us lernd fOren eNgliS in 1st grEd. F hAv nO trubel rIdiN it
sFlentli, but F YlmOst never rFt it. F rFt fonetikli weHer jMziN /rOmAn
leterz wiH kAps fOr H loN vQelz plus 10 stAdard ligacurz wic giv mI abQt
39 fOnImz.

HIz 40 leters HAt broHer /rId krIEted F konsider nirli perfekt fOr
fonetik eNgliS. nQ F Am trFiN t get broHer /gEts t aplF Hem t H
/mFkrOsoft nErESon prOgrAm. kompjMterz stil fFnd it difikult t pronQns
fOren eNgliS.

kompMterz jMz loJik n H mOr HAn 200 lANgwaJez HAt mEk up H dikSonEri
entrIz yr nirli 100% kEos.

F kAn not imAJin fOren eNgliS speliN ever acIviN H stAtis v a world
lANgwaJ.

m. m.

________________________________

Picture this:

A young student hears the word "awry" which happens to be unfamiliar and
wonders if it means what he or she thinks it means.

So, wanting to settle the matter once and for all, the student tries to
look up "awry" in a dictionary and after a long search, is unable to do
so.

Discouragement is likely to follow with perhaps these thoughts or
thoughts similar to them: "Why did I waste my time?" or "Why am I'm so
stupid?" or "Will I ever be competent in English?" etc.

______

Below you'll find a solution to this age-old situation which the English
language–without malice–constantly springs upon its learners and
users.

-- www.phonicspeller.com

hF /meN mAstD v /iNgliS
TANks f pRtisapEtiN in QD fPam.
F agrI HAt a /fOnetik dikSunXI nIds t wxk bOT wEz.
/fOnetik -> /rOmAn n
/rOmAn -> /fOnetik

bF gOiN /fOnetik -> /rOmAn you kAn Hen Mz H /rOmAn fPm
t sxc f H mIniN yn H /intDnet wiT /gMgal.
F TiNk /gMgal wil aksept simpal /fOnetik speliN v H
mP kyman wxdz. trF it Qt.

rigRdz, /pYl /vI.
pI. es. f iksAmpal, it wil tEk informashun f information
________________________attached_________________________
--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "MEng makOtO" <ljptbgx@...>
wrote:
> hir iz a web pEJ [ www.phonicspeller.com ] HAt furHer eksplEnz a
fonetik
> dikSonEri dezFnd fOr HOz hM kAn pronQns a word but hAv nO FdIa hQ
it iz
> speld in fOren eNgliS--wordz lFk "nmn" (nemOnia)-- n wUd never TiNk
t
> lUk fOr it under H leter \p\.
>
> mOst v us lernd fOren eNgliS in 1st grEd. F hAv nO trubel rIdiN it
> sFlentli, but F YlmOst never rFt it. F rFt fonetikli weHer
jMziN /rOmAn
> leterz wiH kAps fOr H loN vQelz plus 10 stAdard ligacurz wic giv mI
abQt
> 39 fOnImz.
>
> HIz 40 leters HAt broHer /rId krIEted F konsider nirli perfekt fOr
> fonetik eNgliS. nQ F Am trFiN t get broHer /gEts t aplF Hem t H
> /mFkrOsoft nErESon prOgrAm. kompjMterz stil fFnd it difikult t
pronQns
> fOren eNgliS.
>
> kompMterz jMz loJik n H mOr HAn 200 lANgwaJez HAt mEk up H dikSonEri
> entrIz yr nirli 100% kEos.
>
> F kAn not imAJin fOren eNgliS speliN ever acIviN H stAtis v a world
> lANgwaJ.
>
> m. m.
>
> ________________________________
>
> Picture this:
>
> A young student hears the word "awry" which happens to be
unfamiliar and
> wonders if it means what he or she thinks it means.
>
> So, wanting to settle the matter once and for all, the student
tries to
> look up "awry" in a dictionary and after a long search, is unable
to do
> so.
>
> Discouragement is likely to follow with perhaps these thoughts or
> thoughts similar to them: "Why did I waste my time?" or "Why am I'm
so
> stupid?" or "Will I ever be competent in English?" etc.
>
> ______
>
> Below you'll find a solution to this age-old situation which the
English
> language–without malice–constantly springs upon its learners and
> users.
>
> -- www.phonicspeller.com
>

Hi Lionel
I am going to go ahead and use the new Ghoti Filleter.
http://www.saytheword.org.uk/shavian/phpghotifilleter/index.php
I will simply exclude all apostrophes from the input,
and consider the Diagraphs Ah + Roar,
Awe + Roar,
Egg + Roar and If + Roar
to be the same as the Shaw letters Are, Or, Air and Ear
respectively in the Shavian output.
Are there any other quirks, to watch out for?

Regards, Paul V.
__________________attached___________________________________________

--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "paul vandenbrink"
<pvandenbrink11@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Lionel
> Thank you for the new version of the Ghoti Filleter.
> And you brought it out so quickly.

> Anyway, I looked at the Shavian Output from a number of test cases
> and there appears to be one particular discrepency.
> It is kind of a neat discrepency, and in is own way, enlightening
> about English pronunciation.
>
> The CMU dictionary uses a much smaller number of symbol's than the
> Shavian Alphabet, even taking into account General American's
> restrictive use of the Shavian Phonemes.
> So you can not use a one to one mapping of letters from the CMU
> Roman format to Shavian.
>
> In particular, it doesn't have the equivalent of the
> Shavian R-Coloured Vowel letters, Are, Or, Ear and Air.
>
> So they get replaced in CMU by some rather clumbersome Diagraphs.
> And those Diagraph's get tranliterated into Shavian as two letters.
> Not surprisingly, some people do write like that, from ignorance,
> but I would really hate to institutionalize it
> in the Ghoti Filleter.
> Ethan and I were just criticizing this practice a few posts back.
>
> So you get
> Ah + Roar instead of Are
> Awe + Roar instead of Or
> Egg + Roar instead of Air
> If + Roar instead of Ear.
>
> The enlightening part is realizing how important
> and prevailent the Ah and Awe sound are to English
> pronunciation, especially in their R-coloured forms.
> Also in some of the Diagraphs, you can see the what the form
> of the real Shavian Letter should be.

Hi Paul,

I wouldn't advise going ahead and using phphGhotiFilleter at all yet,
except as a test. Nothing happened to it last weekend because I
couldn't be bothered, but that was because I'd found the week before
it particularly draining, work-wise. I am more than likely to update
it to some degree this weekend. The first thing I'm going to address
is all the "words" which contain an apostrophe. I'm not aware of any
other quirks, but that is probably because I have hardly studied its
output at all.

If I decide I can't be bothered with phpGF any more (not intended),
I'll certainly let you know, and I'll do a big brainsplurge of all the
PHP code. I will also release 10% of the phpGhotiFilleter code to
anyone who gets the PHP logo tattooed on their person.

LG

--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "paul vandenbrink"
<pvandenbrink11@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Lionel
> I am going to go ahead and use the new Ghoti Filleter.
> http://www.saytheword.org.uk/shavian/phpghotifilleter/index.php
> I will simply exclude all apostrophes from the input,
> and consider the Diagraphs Ah + Roar,
> Awe + Roar,
> Egg + Roar and If + Roar
> to be the same as the Shaw letters Are, Or, Air and Ear
> respectively in the Shavian output.
> Are there any other quirks, to watch out for?
>
> Regards, Paul V.
> __________________attached___________________________________________
>
> --- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "paul vandenbrink"
> <pvandenbrink11@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Lionel
> > Thank you for the new version of the Ghoti Filleter.
> > And you brought it out so quickly.
>
> > Anyway, I looked at the Shavian Output from a number of test cases
> > and there appears to be one particular discrepency.
> > It is kind of a neat discrepency, and in is own way, enlightening
> > about English pronunciation.
> >
> > The CMU dictionary uses a much smaller number of symbol's than the
> > Shavian Alphabet, even taking into account General American's
> > restrictive use of the Shavian Phonemes.
> > So you can not use a one to one mapping of letters from the CMU
> > Roman format to Shavian.
> >
> > In particular, it doesn't have the equivalent of the
> > Shavian R-Coloured Vowel letters, Are, Or, Ear and Air.
> >
> > So they get replaced in CMU by some rather clumbersome Diagraphs.
> > And those Diagraph's get tranliterated into Shavian as two letters.
> > Not surprisingly, some people do write like that, from ignorance,
> > but I would really hate to institutionalize it
> > in the Ghoti Filleter.
> > Ethan and I were just criticizing this practice a few posts back.
> >
> > So you get
> > Ah + Roar instead of Are
> > Awe + Roar instead of Or
> > Egg + Roar instead of Air
> > If + Roar instead of Ear.
> >
> > The enlightening part is realizing how important
> > and prevailent the Ah and Awe sound are to English
> > pronunciation, especially in their R-coloured forms.
> > Also in some of the Diagraphs, you can see the what the form
> > of the real Shavian Letter should be.
>

Lionel Ghoti wrote:

>I will also release 10% of the phpGhotiFilleter code to
>anyone who gets the PHP logo tattooed on their person.
>
>LG
>
>
Sounds tempting, but I think I'll pass! I like PHP, but not that much!

--
Ethan the crazy raven guy - KrrrrAh!

Have you ever wondered what it'd be like to fly like a bird? Wonder no longer! www.maximumride.com

Hi Lionel
Sorry you feel that way about your code.
It worked quite well in both of it's incarnations.
The problems, we brought up could easily be handled by an
exclusion file.
Down with Apostrophes. I even think that
we should filter out some of these extraneous old-fashioned
Homonyms, anyway. Make every one use the word, "also" "as well" instead
of that awkward, "too".
It's all too much. {Oops)
Regards, Paul V.
________________________attached__________________________
--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "Lionel Ghoti" <Lionel.Ghoti@...>
wrote:
> I wouldn't advise going ahead and using phphGhotiFilleter at all yet,
> except as a test. Nothing happened to it last weekend because I
> couldn't be bothered, but that was because I'd found the week before
> it particularly draining, work-wise. I am more than likely to update
> it to some degree this weekend. The first thing I'm going to address
> is all the "words" which contain an apostrophe. I'm not aware of any
> other quirks, but that is probably because I have hardly studied its
> output at all.
>
> If I decide I can't be bothered with phpGF any more (not intended),
> I'll certainly let you know, and I'll do a big brainsplurge of all the
> PHP code. I will also release 10% of the phpGhotiFilleter code to
> anyone who gets the PHP logo tattooed on their person.