Shawalphabet YahooGroup Archive Browser

Nice work! I am looking forward to using when complete.

I would recommend that you created a single css text file, instead of
embedding the style into the html pages. This will make it way easier to
edit the style once you start adding additional html files to the site.

nFs wxk! F Am lUkiN fPwxd t VziN wen kamplIt.

F wUd rekamend HAt V krIEt a singl *kss teks fFl, insted v imbediN H stFl
intM H *html pEJz. His wil mEk it wE IsIx t edit H stFl wans V stRt AdiN
AdiSanal *html fFlz t H sFt.


Have a great day,
Brian Algeri

circtf skribis:
>
> Okay, here's the site as it stands now. It's just the
> "skeleton," really all the navigation's in place and
> the design is pretty much final. Any recommendations
> you have for the link structure would be greatly
> appreciated - it's a bit of a mess right now, I'll admit,
> but it's all here and legible (I hope!).


The general look is okay, but the black text on blue
background is hard to read, especially the dark blue
panel on the left. I can see there are words there, but
I can't read them at all.

I made a copy of the source and changed the text to
white. I think it's a lot easier to read. You can see it
here:

http://www.marlboromats.com/shaw.html

--Ph. D.

Brian: I fully intend to do a seperate CSS file. As it stands I just
wrote it all up in the one file so I could easily make fixes and
adjustments while writing the actual code.

Ph.D.: The black's a temporary color I was using while trying to get the
:hover to work properly. I wasn't sure how visible white would be on the
lighter background, but apparently it looks fine. I may make the hover
background slightly darker and just use white text.

Thanks for the help.

brFan: F fUli intend t dM a seprit kss file. Az it stAndz F Just rOt it
yl up n H wUn fFal sO F cUd Izali mEk fiksiz n adJustments wFal rFtiN H
akSMal kOd.

f.d.: H blak's a tempDXy culD F wuz VziN wFal crFiN t git H :huvD t wxk
propDli. F wuzan't Sx hQ vizibal wFt wUd bI on H lFtD bakgrQnd, but it
apErantli lUks fFn. F mE mEk H huvD bakgrQnd slFtli dRkD n Just Vz wFt
tekst.

TEnks fP H help.

************
/H /mistik /tQx
fram fXfAks kRtrFt's
H mistik rOz fram H gRden v H kiN

pXagrAf's 7 HrM 9

Hen mF /gFd tacd mI upon H SOldx n sed: 'HFn F hAT sIn but H Qtx
Sel v /hVmAnitI, n HQ Rt depresd HXbF. sIkest HQ nQ t nO wat hAT bin
rivIld t H /sOl v /mAn, n wat R H limits v /hVmAn /noliJ!'

F riplFd: 'F Am wiliN, f mF hRt TxsteT f /noliJ.'

mF /gFd wiT hiz wYnd tacd a smYl n hiden dP in H ruged wYlz f H
trFANelx /tQx, wic Opend n Admited us; Hen hI txnd t mI n sed: 'H /tQx
iz hF n it kantEneT seven levalz, n on Ic leval R HrI /cEmbxz, n abav
Yl lIT wan /cEmbx, n H asent HXtM iz loN n wCIsam.' F riplFd: 'mF mAstx,
HF fUtsteps wil F folO. Hen wI bigAn H asent, n wen wI rIcd H first
leval mF /gFd txnd t mI n sed: 'bihOld H /fxst /cEmbx!' a hevI vEl klOsd H
entrens; mF /gFd pUSd it asFd n wI entxd wiTin H /cEmbx. HX wI fQnd Rselvz
in dRknes, n Y sIzd mI, sO HAt F pPd mF /sOl Qt in prEx, krEviN in hVmilitI
v spirit f ilMminESen. n wen F hAd bin HX sam tFm F lifted up mF Fz, n it
sImd t mI HAt mF hed waz insxkld bF sOl-inspFxiN lFt, wFl mF fIt rimEnd
lost in H dRknes v /unrIAlitI; n mF /inteligens waz kwikend bF a mesAJ fram
abav, n F nM HAt H /sOl v /mAn - H riflekSen v H /VnitI - iz suspended
bitwIn H /lFt n H /dRknes, n HrM H opOsiSen f H /lFt n H /dRknes H /sOl
v /mAn gEnz konSisnes v H /unnOn wic vElz H /itxnal /VnitI. n H mistik simbal
v H /VnitI SOn fPT upon H wYlz v His /cEmbx.

************

regRdz,
/brFAn /AlJxI
http://shavian.metabright.com/

Hi Circ
The overall format looks really good.
Obviously you have to fill in the Text sections, but the overall
order and design of the teaching program is more important.

I especially like the idea of a Reading and a Writing Section,
repeating the Sample materials. I may incorporate the idea in my book
if you don't mind.
I would suggest putting the Shavian Sentence first and then the Roman
transliteration underneath in a much smaller font, in the Reading
Practice section.

As for the Writing Practice section, I would put in exactly the same
material but in a different format.
I would suggest putting the Regular Roman Sentence first and then
leave room (input boxes) underneath where the Learner can type in his
Shavian equivalent of the Sample sentence in a Shavian font. After he
completes a page, he can print it off and check it against the same
sample back in the Reading section.
That way the learner can quickly self test his or her understanding
of Shavian.

Regards, Paul V.
___________________attached_______________________________
--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "circtf" <circtf@...> wrote:
>
> Brian: I fully intend to do a seperate CSS file. As it stands I just
> wrote it all up in the one file so I could easily make fixes and
> adjustments while writing the actual code.

Lesson 1 – Strong Dull Consonants

English written in the Shavian Alphabet can get along quite nicely,
with fewer letters.
You might ask then, "Why does Shavian have some many letters (47), if
it needs fewer to write out the words?"
It has so many letters because it concentrates on the significant
sounds, and has a single letter for each sound and because it only
needs one letter per sound, it only requires the minimum number of
letters to write any word.
In fact, there are 47 different Shaw Letters, but most of them are
not heavily used. Vowels letters, especially, are reserved for key
locations, where they are essential for the recognition of the word.
Remember, in English there is only one vowel sound for each syllable,
and as most common English words have only one syllable, that works
out to be one vowel letter per word.

So when writing in the Shaw Alphabet, we will concentrate on the
Consonant Letters.
The Shaw Alphabet has 24 Consonant Letters.
In the first examples, we will focus on 4 simple Consonant Letters
that are very commonly needed. We will show some short sample English
words, which use these letters. These words as they all start with 1
of the 4 consonant sounds, will not have prominent Vowel sounds, so
vowel letters will also not be as prominent. Remember with the Shaw
Alphabet, it is the consonant sounds that count, and the Vowel sounds
are obviously less significant. Vowel letters are shorter than the
Consonant letters.

This lesson is an introduction to the first 4 plain and simple
consonant letters of the Shaw Alphabet.
These letters represent the most common voiced consonant sounds in
English. These consonant letters are Deep, so these letters extend
below the line. Here are some simple examples.
Note that these consonants are joined together with a Vowel marker or
placeholder to make up some short words.

So first, we look at the Stressed Consonants Vow, Bib, Dead and Gag,
pronounced Vee, Bee, Dee and Gee respectively.
The Gee is pronounced as in the English word "greed", without the "r"
or "d" sounds, not like "Gee, Whiz".

Vow (i.e. Volvo)
{v *vOlvO}

Bib (i.e. baby)
{b bEbI}

Dead (i.e. dad)
{d dAd}

Gag (i.e. greed)

{g grId}

Here is a good example word, where all 4 of these Shaw letters are
used.
Each of these 4 letters are used to make up the word "vagabond".
{vAgabynd}


The extra consonant letter is called an Nun, and is used to write
the "N" sound.


Or these same Shaw letters can be used to write the phrase, "golden
brown hot dogs".

{gOldan hyt dygz}

See how the O-sound after Gag, is written with a big O
letter called "Oak"
Or some of these same Shaw letters can be used to make up the
phrase, "green eggs and red pepper taste better when they are very
well cooked."
{grIn egz n red pepD tEst betD wen HE R vXI wel kUkt}

Don't expect to recognize all the other letters yet, but take a look
of the first letter of the second word.
Note that "Eggs" is the first word we have written so far that
starts with a Shavian Vowel Letter. That letter is called Egg.and you
will see it six times in the phrase, "green eggs and red pepper taste
better when they are very well cooked."

Take a look again at how short this phrase is, in Shavian letters.
On to the next lesson to look at more Consonant letters.


Learning Hints

Vowels are by far the most variable and complex part of English
pronunciation and consequently the Letters that we use to write them
are left to the later lessons. Determining the right letter to use
for the Longer Vowels is a little more complicated than figuring out
the right vowel Letter for the simpler vowel sounds. There are just
24 plain Consonant letters in Shavian, and 23 Vowel letters.
This is quite a jump from the 5 vowel letters
in the Roman Alphabet.
We will be teaching all the basic concepts of Vowel Representation
later on in Lessons 8 through Lesson 14

Still, you may be curious, as to how the Vowels were written in the
previous examples, so we will give you
a quick briefing on the workings of Vowels within the Shaw Alphabet.
It will familiarize you with what the Shaw Vowel Letters looks like.

Using the Shaw Alphabet, you can write any English vowel sound with
either a Vowel Letter or put in a Hyphen, as a placeholder if you are
not sure about the exact sound
Just to optimize reading and simplify writing, we will use that as
our vowel writing strategy, while we are getting up to speed.

Using a Hyphen when we are not sure, allows us to continue writing
down the more important sounds.
And just like someone writing Shorthand, you can usually still
recognize the sound of the word from context within the sentence.

The Vowel Letters are broken down into 5 categories. Minimal Vowels
(2), Short or Soft Vowels (6),
Long Vowels (4), Dipthongs (5), Liquid Vowels (6), and Liquid
Dipthong Vowel Combinations (5).
The 2 Vowel letters for the minimal Vowel sounds are Ado and Array.

And then there are the 6 Short or Soft Vowel Letters, that you are
more familiar with
Ash, Egg, If, On/Ah, Wool and Up
{A, e, I, Y, U and u}
These vowels are pronounced like the Vowel sounds in their names.
They are very common English Vowel sound, especially when the word or
syllable begins and ends with a Consonant and the vowel sounds joins
them all together.

We will talk more about the other longer Vowel sounds and the vowel
glides or Dipthongs,
in a later lesson.
We don't want to slow you down, by talking about rare sounds in
English at this point.

Hi Brian,

I've noticed your many transcriptions with interest, but haven't had
the leisure to study any of them at all closely until now.

--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Algeri" wrote:
[snip]
> F riplFd: 'F Am wiliN, f mF hRt TxsteT f /noliJ.'
>
> mF /gFd wiT hiz wYnd tacd a smYl n hiden dP in H ruged wYlz f H
> trFANelx /tQx, wic Opend n Admited us;

I find this transcription a little ... weird, on these grounds:

1. It seems to say that the word "for" can be represented by a
mere "f", implying that the "f" sound is followed by no vowel at
all. Yet to my ears, English usually has the vowel you represent
by "Y" (as in the word "smYl" for "small") in "for" when stressed,
and a schwa-r (neutral vowel with rhotic offglide) in "for" when
unstressed. So I'd think that "fY" was nearer than "f".

2. The second sentence has "wand" (wYnd) rhyming with "small"
(smYl). At least in AusE, one needs the same vowel as
in "knowledge" (noliJ) in the word "wand", which would then be
transcribed "wond" instead of "wYnd".

3. Doesn't the word "triangular" have a "g" sound after the "ng",
thus: "trFANgelx"/"trFANgyelx"/"trFANyUlx"?

I appreciate there may be conventions operating here of which I'm
unaware. However, at least on the points which I've mentioned, one
could hope for a closer phonetic transcription.

A couple of questions: Does this English-Latin alphabet style of
transcription have a short name? And does it provide an exact
equivalent for each one of the Shavian alphabet symbols?

Regards,
Yahya

yahya_melb wrote:
>

> I've noticed your many transcriptions with interest, but
> haven't had the leisure to study any of them at all closely
> until now.
>
> In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "Brian Algeri" wrote:
>>
>> [snip]
>>
>> F riplFd: 'F Am wiliN, f mF hRt TxsteT f /noliJ.'
>>
>> mF /gFd wiT hiz wYnd tacd a smYl n hiden dP in H ruged wYlz f H
>> trFANelx /tQx, wic Opend n Admited us;
>
> I find this transcription a little . . . weird, on these grounds:
>
> 1. It seems to say that the word "for" can be represented
> by a mere "f", implying that the "f" sound is followed by
> no vowel at all. Yet to my ears, English usually has the
> vowel you represent by "Y" (as in the word "smYl" for
> "small") in "for" when stressed, and a schwa-r (neutral
> vowel with rhotic offglide) in "for" when unstressed. So
> I'd think that "fY" was nearer than "f".

Some people on this list have adopted "f"all by itself as an
abbreviation for "for". It is not canonical.

--Ph. D.

Hello Yahya,

1. I am using f as an abbreviation for "for" instead of fP.

2. To me o sounds the same as Y. You are right wand is
pronounced as 'wänd
http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/wand

3. Yes you are right triangle is pronounced 'trI-"a[ng]-g&l
http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/triangle.

Usually I just write the Shavian as it sounds to me and do not always
check the pronunciation with the dictionary. I guess I should check
more often.

>> Does this English-Latin alphabet style of transcription have a short
>> name?
I do not know.

>> And does it provide an exact equivalent for each one of the Shavian
>> alphabet symbols?
I am not sure on this. Paul do you know? Thanks.

Thanks for the comments.

Regards,
Brian

On 7/22/06, yahya_melb <yahya@...> wrote:
> does it provide an exact
> equivalent for each one of the Shavian alphabet symbols?

It does.

It's based on Ross DeMeyere's Shavian fonts -- which weren't Unicode
fonts, since there was no Shavian Unicode assignment back then (I
think that even the CSUR registration wasn't up back then). They were
simply eight-bit fonts which mapped Shavian glyphs to ASCII letters
(as did many other fonts for other writing systems back then).

And since those fonts contained all Shaw alphabet symbols, this
"English-Latin alphabet style transcription" can represent all Shaw
alphabet symbols, simply by using the character with the ASCII code
that would result in the appropriate glyph in that font. (If that
makes sense.)

I don't think there's a short name for that transcription
(transliteration, rather); "ASCII Shavian", perhaps?

To my knowledge, all non-Unicode Shaw alphabet fonts have followed the
original mapping, with only minor modifications, if any (for example,
the namer dot can be G or / or both; yew can be on ü as well as on V).

It's become a sort of de-facto standard on the list. Also partly
because not many clients support plane 1 Unicode, so if you want to
use Shaw alphabet characters, the best solution so far seems to be to
send HTML mail and to specify an eight-bit Shaw alphabet font -- and
those who don't have that font will then see ASCII Shavian instead. So
after a while, you learn to read it.

Cheers,
--
Philip Newton <philip.newton@...>