Shawalphabet YahooGroup Archive Browser

Wow, there's a lot more interest than I expected.

One thing I'd like to know everyone's opinion about whether Androcles is
the best model for spellings. My personal opinion is that it could use a
rewrite (especially for the vast majority of words ending in -le, where
Androcles tends to add an unneeded schwa before the L). I myself speak
General American (or Expatriate American, if it really does exist) and
am lousy at even trying to imitate RP written or otherwise.

As for which version to use, it is quite true that the NET does handle
many translational issues in a rather confusing way. Does anyone have a
better alternative that is also in contemporary English and under a free
license? Also, if the American Bible Society is willing to help,
amazing.

I've been working on Mark too. It would be interesting to compare our
transcriptions, Thomas.

--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, "tim_rice09" <tim_rice09@...>
wrote:
>
> It looks like activity around here has been slacking off lately, let's
> see if this elicits some responses.
>
> I've been turning this idea around in my head for a while, and wonder
if
> anyone else in this group has a similar interest. With the high
> availability of public domain Bibles that exists and the massive
> advantage that Unicode acceptance has given Shavian, it's high time to
> produce a full Shavian edition of the Bible. I have already started
> experimenting with tools such as Bibedit (which has full Shavian
> compatibility and the ability to export in the Sword format) and the
New
> English Translation, which has an intentionally free copyright and to
be
> honest, sounds a lot better than most of the other free (as in speech
> and beer) versions.
>
> The first (and by far the most important) goal of this project is to
> produce a full transliteration of the Christian Bible in contemporary
> English with a highly permissive license. A digital copy in Unicode
> encoding can easily be converted into other formats and perhaps one
day
> be printed and bound. What's needed is people willing to help
> transliterate (a chapter a day by one person would take around three
> years) and people willing to copy-edit and weed out the mistakes that
> will inevitably creep into the project.
>
> Working together, big things become small.
>
> And if the Christian scriptures aren't your cup of tea, perhaps this
can
> serve as a catalyst for getting other scriptures into Shavian too.
>

On 6 September 2010 16:09, tim_rice09 <tim_rice09@...> wrote:
> I've been working on Mark too. It would be interesting to compare our
> transcriptions, Thomas.

On 6 September 2010 16:41, Robert Richmond <rsrichmond@...> wrote:
> I'd like to see the two prototype transliterations of Mark that were mentioned.

I'll export it to HTML after work this evening and upload it. This
should be interesting.

T

On Mon, Sep 6, 2010 at 22:09, tim_rice09 <tim_rice09@...> wrote:
> As for which version to use, it is quite true that the NET does handle
> many translational issues in a rather confusing way. Does anyone have a
> better alternative that is also in contemporary English and under a free
> license?

I don't know about better, but "free licence" brings to my mind the
World English Bible (based on the American Standard Version of 1901):
http://ebible.org/web/ . It's in the Public Domain, so you don't get
freer than that.

Cheers,
Philip
--
Philip Newton <philip.newton@...>

My transcription of Mark (with much of the heavy lifting being done by
machine-assisted transcription, for which I also want to thank Philip for
invaluable assistance with the database) is here:

http://spectrum.myriadcolours.com/~marnanel/mark.html

Thomas

Amazing, I'm still reading through it.
By the way, is there any way to streamline the installation of the
transcriber? I'm a decent script monkey but so far it's complaining
about unfulfillable dependencies and lack of YAML, though I do in fact
have that installed.

-Tim

--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, Thomas Thurman <tthurman@...>
wrote:
>
> My transcription of Mark (with much of the heavy lifting being done by
> machine-assisted transcription, for which I also want to thank Philip
for
> invaluable assistance with the database) is here:
>
> http://spectrum.myriadcolours.com/~marnanel/mark.html
>
> Thomas
>

On 7 September 2010 15:13, tim_rice09 <tim_rice09@...> wrote:
> Amazing, I'm still reading through it.
> By the way, is there any way to streamline the installation of the
> transcriber? I'm a decent script monkey but so far it's complaining
> about unfulfillable dependencies and lack of YAML, though I do in fact
> have that installed.

That's odd: YAML shouldn't matter either way: CPAN uses it, but it's
an optional dependency.

I did find a mistake in my tests yesterday which prevented me from
installing one of the dependencies, so I wouldn't be surprised if that
was your problem. I'll try and fix it soon and upload a fixed
version, and I'll let you know when I do.

Thomas

Thanks

--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, Thomas Thurman <tthurman@...> wrote:
>
> On 7 September 2010 15:13, tim_rice09 <tim_rice09@...> wrote:
> > Amazing, I'm still reading through it.
> > By the way, is there any way to streamline the installation of the
> > transcriber? I'm a decent script monkey but so far it's complaining
> > about unfulfillable dependencies and lack of YAML, though I do in fact
> > have that installed.
>
> That's odd: YAML shouldn't matter either way: CPAN uses it, but it's
> an optional dependency.
>
> I did find a mistake in my tests yesterday which prevented me from
> installing one of the dependencies, so I wouldn't be surprised if that
> was your problem. I'll try and fix it soon and upload a fixed
> version, and I'll let you know when I do.
>
> Thomas
>

(The Unifon Converter) is not the most advanced converter but if you had
something similar it would be useful since you do not have to download
the font to view.

--- Thomas Thurman wrote

> > I have in fact done something similar at http://shavian.org, and it
> doesn't require Explorer, but not everything is a website.

> Thomas

It may not require MS Explorer to view, but it does require a download.
Otherwise it is gibberish. --Steve


- - - - - - - -

Re: Shavian transliterator: bernard
Transliterators

The Unifon group developed a text converter that displayed the special
characters as long as you accessed it with MS Internet Explorer.
You should be able to do the same with the Shaw Alphabet.

Unifon converter <http://66.41.58.65/UFLookup/UFXLate.htm>
http://66.41.58.65/UFLookup/UFXLate.htm

about unifon <http://www.unifon.org/htm/unifon%20alphabet.htm>

GP Table Unifon-IPA correspondences

[http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e25/majorbett/Unifon/luv-gtabl.gif]

This is not the most advanced converter but if you had something
similar it would be useful since you do not have to download the font
to view.

The downside is that when you copy and paste, you end up with the
keyboard code rather than the special character.

Both Unifon and Shavian have Unicode descriptions but I don't know how
to take advantage of this.

There is a good IPA <http://upodn.com/phun.asp> converter now at
http://upodn.com/phun.asp <http://upodn.com/phun.asp>
You probably need to change your encoding to Unicode UTF-8 to view
correctly.
Turn your text into fənɛ́tɪks



--- In shawalphabet@yahoogroups.com, Thomas Thurman <tthurman@...>
wrote:

> I've accumulated a large number of ad-hoc transliteration scripts over
the
> years. A while ago, I decided to merge them all into one program, so
that I
> could share them easily with other people. After some delay, I've
released
> the first rough version of the script, which I call *bernard* (credit
to
> Jeremy K for thinking of the name). Bernard has been used to good
effect in
> the Shavian translation of GNOME.

> You can read the current documentation, such as it is, at:
>
http://search.cpan.org/~marnanel/App-Bernard-0.01/lib/App/Bernard.pm<htt\
p://search.cpan.org/%7Emarnanel/App-Bernard-0.01/lib/App/Bernard.pm>
> This gives you a rough overview, but there are several features as yet
> unimplemented which are mentioned there, and a few features which
> *are*implemented which aren't mentioned. The majority of my
> transliteration
> scripts are still not merged into bernard: this version is "release
early,
> release often".

> You can install it, if you have CPAN access, using:
> *cpan install App::Bernard*

> Otherwise, you may download it at
>
http://search.cpan.org/CPAN/authors/id/M/MA/MARNANEL/App-Bernard-0.01.ta\
r.gz

> In case you don't have a setup which allows you to run bernard, I was
> thinking of making a web interface. You would be able to upload files
and
> download the transliterated versions. However, this would take time
away
> from adding new features to the main version. Would this be useful for
> anyone?

> There may be new versions of the script coming in the next few weeks;
please
> let me know what features you'd find useful from the unimplemented
features
> list (or any other features you'd like).

> Thomas

On 25 September 2010 17:00, stbett <stbett@...> wrote:

>
> It may not require MS Explorer to view, but it does require a download.
> Otherwise it is gibberish. --Steve
>
> Please don't spread misinformation. If you use any modern graphical
browser with the site, it embeds the font. There is no separate download
necessary.

If this does not work for you, please let me know your browser and platform
and I will look into it.

Thomas

Hey everyone

As you likely already know, Battle for Wesnoth is the first
professional-grade game to support Shavian. As of the last stable release
(version 1.8) you can select "English Shavian" from the language menu and
play a majority of the game, including unit names, story, and dialog in the
Shaw alphabet. We even have a modified (redrawn to use only 7k) Andagii
font included in the game's download so you don't even need to install extra
fonts to get it to work.

For those who don't have this font already and want to use it elsewhere,
http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/*checkout*/wesnoth/trunk/fonts/Andagii.ttf

You can download Battle for Wesnoth from http://www.wesnoth.org/ for free,
including the source code, for Linux, MacOSX, and Windows.

However, the translation was not complete and we need volunteers to get it
finished before the next stable release (1.10). We have scripts to automate
a vast majority of the work, what we need are proofreaders and proper names
(which are too unique to add to the latin->shaw dictionary) translated by
hand. There are two major areas that especially need help; random names and
translating campaigns.

Random names are built from lists containing dozens of race-specific names
which are randomly cut and pasted together to generate new names. For
example, the elven names "Caliril" and "Elimir" may be cut into "Cali" and
"limir" (matched by the "li") to form "Calimir". Our transliteration to
"𐑒𐑨𐑤𐑦𐑮𐑦𐑤" and "𐑧𐑤𐑦𐑥𐑽" would still produce "𐑒𐑨𐑤𐑦𐑥𐑽" by the
same code. There's a lot of these names to be done by hand, though. If you
want to help I can email you a list for a race, all you need is a text
editor (or your email client, if it supports utf-8). Its really easy.

Campaigns more involved - you'll need to install a gettext .po editor such
as Poedit (http://www.poedit.net/ - its free) and proofread/complete the
translations of all the "fuzzy" phrases (the phrases the dictionary script
couldn't complete on its own). You don't need to commit to finishing it,
every little bit helps. You can see from the below link which campaigns
(roughly everything under wesnoth-manual) need how much work. As you can
see, the two campaigns that need the most work (haven't even been started)
are Northern Rebirth (wesnoth-nr) and Under the Burning Suns
(wesnoth-ubts).

Transliterating is a great way to practice typing and reading shavian, plus
you get your name in the credit roll of this awesome game!

Current transliteration stats are updated regularly:
http://www.wesnoth.org/gettext/index.lang.php?version=trunk&package=&lang=en@shaw