Shavian eGroup Archive Browser
From: Paul Vandenbrink
Date: 2004-05-19 18:59:10 #
Subject: move [shavian] forum to another site (i.e.omniglot.com)
Toggle Shavian
Hi Philip
I certainly would prefer to remain with Yahoo Groups, unless we have a
consistent SPAM problem. It is easy to get to, and I am on a couple other
Discussion groups there as well. So this group is convenient for me.
Regards, Paul V
>___________Philip comments:_________________
>Sounds interesting.
>
>IMO, though, a web forum is not a good replacement for a mailing list. Maybe
>something that could exist in addition, but not to replace it.
>
>Ideally, we'd have something threaded (IIRC phpbb always displays the newest
>comment at the end regardless of which comment it is in reply to); some
>email clients can do this for you. (Even better might be a newsgroup, but
>getting one set up would be even harder.)
>
>If we did move off Yahoo!Groups, I'd suggest taking up Scott's offer and
>hosting a new mailing list on shavian.org. However, I have the impression
>that the consensus is currently to stay with the Yahoo!Group.
>
>Cheers,
>Philip
>--
>Philip Newton <Philip.Newton@...>
>All opinions are my own, not my employer's.
>If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
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From: paul vandenbrink
Date: 2004-05-20 00:50:01 #
Subject: [shavian] Republishing Shaw's Androcles and the Lion in America
Toggle Shavian
Hi Hugh & Paige
I believe we should be able to go ahead with the project, and have
the book published in America. We need two fonts. One smaller one for
the Stage Directions of which there are a plentitude, and a cleaner
font for the Dialog of the Play. Perhaps even a third font for the
notes and foreward, which were not transliterated in the original
edition.
It would be appropriate to have an epilogue to the book written
solely in the Shaw Alphabet.
Regards, Paul V.
_____________attached_____________________________
--- In shavian@..., "Hugh Birkenhead" <mixsynth@f...>
wrote:
> Subject: RE: [shavian] Re: getting hold of Shaw's Androcles and
the Lion
>>
> If the original Androcles and the Lion is not copyrighted any more
in the States, and the Shaw Alphabet transliteration is nothing more
than an alternative representation of the original text, what is to
stop us from going ahead with reprinting it ourselves? Maybe we can't
do that in Europe, but why not in the States at least?
>
>>>
> Hugh B
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From: Star Raven
Date: 2004-05-20 03:04:24 #
Subject: Re: [shavian] Republishing Shaw's Androcles and the Lion in America
Toggle Shavian
Hey neat! when do we start? Great idea for the epilogue too!
--Star
--- paul vandenbrink <pvandenbrink@...> wrote:
> Hi Hugh & Paige
>
> I believe we should be able to go ahead with the project, and have
> the book published in America. We need two fonts. One smaller one for
>
> the Stage Directions of which there are a plentitude, and a cleaner
> font for the Dialog of the Play. Perhaps even a third font for the
> notes and foreward, which were not transliterated in the original
> edition.
> It would be appropriate to have an epilogue to the book written
> solely in the Shaw Alphabet.
>
> Regards, Paul V.
>
> _____________attached_____________________________
>
> --- In shavian@..., "Hugh Birkenhead" <mixsynth@f...>
> wrote:
> > Subject: RE: [shavian] Re: getting hold of Shaw's Androcles and
> the Lion
> >>
> > If the original Androcles and the Lion is not copyrighted any more
> in the States, and the Shaw Alphabet transliteration is nothing more
> than an alternative representation of the original text, what is to
> stop us from going ahead with reprinting it ourselves? Maybe we can't
>
> do that in Europe, but why not in the States at least?
> >
> >>>
> > Hugh B
>
>
=====
"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use."
-Kierkegaard
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From: Star Raven
Date: 2004-05-20 03:04:24 #
Subject: Re: [shavian] Republishing Shaw's Androcles and the Lion in America
Toggle Shavian
Hey neat! when do we start? Great idea for the epilogue too!
--Star
--- paul vandenbrink <pvandenbrink@...> wrote:
> Hi Hugh & Paige
>
> I believe we should be able to go ahead with the project, and have
> the book published in America. We need two fonts. One smaller one for
>
> the Stage Directions of which there are a plentitude, and a cleaner
> font for the Dialog of the Play. Perhaps even a third font for the
> notes and foreward, which were not transliterated in the original
> edition.
> It would be appropriate to have an epilogue to the book written
> solely in the Shaw Alphabet.
>
> Regards, Paul V.
>
> _____________attached_____________________________
>
> --- In shavian@..., "Hugh Birkenhead" <mixsynth@f...>
> wrote:
> > Subject: RE: [shavian] Re: getting hold of Shaw's Androcles and
> the Lion
> >>
> > If the original Androcles and the Lion is not copyrighted any more
> in the States, and the Shaw Alphabet transliteration is nothing more
> than an alternative representation of the original text, what is to
> stop us from going ahead with reprinting it ourselves? Maybe we can't
>
> do that in Europe, but why not in the States at least?
> >
> >>>
> > Hugh B
>
>
=====
"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use."
-Kierkegaard
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From: Joe
Date: 2004-05-20 03:22:08 #
Subject: [shavian] Re: A new Shavian font.
Toggle Shavian
--- In shavian@..., Bob Schmertz <rschmertz@s...> wrote:
> Thanks. And remember, you could always raise the priority on that. You
> could probably skip your daughter's piano recital, for example; just
> tell her you've got to make a fixed-width Shavian font, and she'll be
> sure to understand (as a bonus, everyone else will be out of the
> house, and you'll be free to really focus on it!).
>
> --
> Cheers,
> Bob Schmertz
Hey, this thread is back from the dead! Anyway, I should point out that I don't have a
daughter. Or any other kids. I don't have any such attachments, and I'd like to keep
it that way for a while. I'm only 18!
But you made a good point. I did raise the priority on that font, and the result is
available at:
http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/
IBGsQFCZhVX8EEv1FaqXOorBn0ATwY7Kk_DHZOkIQh7b0aEf-O7g-
CpM3RutPcXVbcNIzw0CbUP-mcPxxMHGm-uair0AAFLBtEMP/fonts/windows/
shaw_mono.ttf
That's a long URL. Anyway, it's in the group's files. It could probably use some work,
but I'd appreciate it if people would try it out and give me their opinions. And, even
though it's technically a Windows font, it should still work in Mac OS X.
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From: paul vandenbrink
Date: 2004-05-20 15:09:44 #
Subject: [shavian] Re: Republishing Shaw's Androcles and the Lion in America
Toggle Shavian
Hi Star
First thing, is the book has to be all typed into a set of computer
files. I suggest that we use Hugh & Phil's Ikonboard, because it
allows for both T.O. aand the Shaw Alphabet files. Also it has
viewing and editing facilities, so the work can be checked by
everybody and easily corrected.
Secondly, as a pre-requisite to the first step we need to break the
Book down into managable chunks. Since I have copy of the original,
I can put the Outline of the book down, so eveyone will know how the
pieces fit together.
Thirdly, Some one needs to write the Epilogue.
Regards, Paul V.
___________________attached_________________________________________
--- In shavian@..., Star Raven <celestraof12worlds@y...>
wrote:
> Hey neat! when do we start? Great idea for the epilogue too!
> --Star
>
> --- paul vandenbrink <pvandenbrink@s...> wrote:
> > Hi Hugh & Paige
> >
> > I believe we should be able to go ahead with the project, and
have the book published in America. We need two fonts. One smaller
one for the Stage Directions of which there are a plentitude, and a
cleaner font for the Dialog of the Play. Perhaps even a third font
for the notes and foreward, which were not transliterated in the
original edition.
It would be appropriate to have an epilogue to the book written
solely in the Shaw Alphabet.
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From: paul vandenbrink
Date: 2004-05-20 16:05:45 #
Subject: [shavian] Congratulations on a new and better Shavian font.
Toggle Shavian
Thanks, Joe
Above all for raising the priority on making this new font.
Who needs a new piano anyway. A fixed-width Shavian font, is much
more useful innovation.
I really liked Shaw-Mono. Almost all the letters were more clearly
differentiated in your format, and most of them looked better
esthetically as well. I especially like your take on the Yea and the
W letter. Normally they look a little out of place in most Shaw
fonts, but here in your font, they fit right in.
So now let me quibble a little bit about the ones that I thought
could be improved.
1. I like the new form for Urge/Err and Air. They remind me of Mayan
Glyphs for some reason. But, unforunately they resemble each other
too much. It is hard to distinguish them from each other, in the
smaller point sizes. I didn't like the look of the "ar" letter, but
all the other r-sound letters looked great.
2. Ian looks too much like a lower case "r" in T.O. But then I rarely
use Ian anyway, so I can live with that.
3. The Up letter looks like typesetting error, top heavy or something.
Regards, Paul V.
P.S. What is the new Shaw Character represented by pressing an upper
case "L"?
It looks nice but I didn't recognise what it is for.
______________________attached_______________________________________
--- In shavian@..., "Joe" <allegrox_2000@y...> wrote:
> Hey, this thread is back from the dead! Anyway, I should point out
that I don't have a
> daughter. Or any other kids. I don't have any such attachments,
and I'd like to keep
> it that way for a while. I'm only 18!
>
> But you made a good point. I did raise the priority on that font,
and the result is
> available at:
>
> http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/
> IBGsQFCZhVX8EEv1FaqXOorBn0ATwY7Kk_DHZOkIQh7b0aEf-O7g-
> CpM3RutPcXVbcNIzw0CbUP-mcPxxMHGm-uair0AAFLBtEMP/fonts/windows/
> shaw_mono.ttf
>
> That's a long URL. Anyway, it's in the group's files. It could
probably use some work,
> but I'd appreciate it if people would try it out and give me their
opinions. And, even
> though it's technically a Windows font, it should still work in Mac
OS X.
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From: Craig Butz
Date: 2004-05-20 23:21:38 #
Subject: [shavian] Re: Republishing Shaw's Androcles and the Lion in America
Toggle Shavian
Actually, you will need three faces for the main body. The original
has the names in bold, the directions in italic, and the main text is
plain. I really would prefer to see a facsimile reprinting, as the
original font is really quite gorgeous.
Craig
On May 20, 2004, at 5:58 PM, shavian@... wrote:
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> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> ~->
>
> There are 2 messages in this issue.
>
> Topics in this digest:
>
> 1. Re: Republishing Shaw's Androcles and the Lion in America
> From: "paul vandenbrink" <pvandenbrink@...>
> 2. Congratulations on a new and better Shavian font.
> From: "paul vandenbrink" <pvandenbrink@...>
>
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> _
> _______________________________________________________________________
> _
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 14:07:39 -0000
> From: "paul vandenbrink" <pvandenbrink@...>
> Subject: Re: Republishing Shaw's Androcles and the Lion in America
>
> Hi Star
>
> First thing, is the book has to be all typed into a set of computer
> files. I suggest that we use Hugh & Phil's Ikonboard, because it
> allows for both T.O. aand the Shaw Alphabet files. Also it has
> viewing and editing facilities, so the work can be checked by
> everybody and easily corrected.
> Secondly, as a pre-requisite to the first step we need to break the
> Book down into managable chunks. Since I have copy of the original,
> I can put the Outline of the book down, so eveyone will know how the
> pieces fit together.
> Thirdly, Some one needs to write the Epilogue.
>
> Regards, Paul V.
>
> ___________________attached_________________________________________
>
>
> --- In shavian@..., Star Raven <celestraof12worlds@y...>
> wrote:
>> Hey neat! when do we start? Great idea for the epilogue too!
>> --Star
>>
>> --- paul vandenbrink <pvandenbrink@s...> wrote:
>>> Hi Hugh & Paige
>>>
>>> I believe we should be able to go ahead with the project, and
> have the book published in America. We need two fonts. One smaller
> one for the Stage Directions of which there are a plentitude, and a
> cleaner font for the Dialog of the Play. Perhaps even a third font
> for the notes and foreward, which were not transliterated in the
> original edition.
> It would be appropriate to have an epilogue to the book written
> solely in the Shaw Alphabet.
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> _
> _______________________________________________________________________
> _
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 15:02:46 -0000
> From: "paul vandenbrink" <pvandenbrink@...>
> Subject: Congratulations on a new and better Shavian font.
>
> Thanks, Joe
> Above all for raising the priority on making this new font.
> Who needs a new piano anyway. A fixed-width Shavian font, is much
> more useful innovation.
> I really liked Shaw-Mono. Almost all the letters were more clearly
> differentiated in your format, and most of them looked better
> esthetically as well. I especially like your take on the Yea and the
> W letter. Normally they look a little out of place in most Shaw
> fonts, but here in your font, they fit right in.
>
> So now let me quibble a little bit about the ones that I thought
> could be improved.
>
> 1. I like the new form for Urge/Err and Air. They remind me of Mayan
> Glyphs for some reason. But, unforunately they resemble each other
> too much. It is hard to distinguish them from each other, in the
> smaller point sizes. I didn't like the look of the "ar" letter, but
> all the other r-sound letters looked great.
>
> 2. Ian looks too much like a lower case "r" in T.O. But then I rarely
> use Ian anyway, so I can live with that.
>
> 3. The Up letter looks like typesetting error, top heavy or something.
>
> Regards, Paul V.
>
> P.S. What is the new Shaw Character represented by pressing an upper
> case "L"?
> It looks nice but I didn't recognise what it is for.
>
> ______________________attached_______________________________________
>
> --- In shavian@..., "Joe" <allegrox_2000@y...> wrote:
>> Hey, this thread is back from the dead! Anyway, I should point out
> that I don't have a
>> daughter. Or any other kids. I don't have any such attachments,
> and I'd like to keep
>> it that way for a while. I'm only 18!
>>
>> But you made a good point. I did raise the priority on that font,
> and the result is
>> available at:
>>
>> http://f1.grp.yahoofs.com/v1/
>> IBGsQFCZhVX8EEv1FaqXOorBn0ATwY7Kk_DHZOkIQh7b0aEf-O7g-
>> CpM3RutPcXVbcNIzw0CbUP-mcPxxMHGm-uair0AAFLBtEMP/fonts/windows/
>> shaw_mono.ttf
>>
>> That's a long URL. Anyway, it's in the group's files. It could
> probably use some work,
>> but I'd appreciate it if people would try it out and give me their
> opinions. And, even
>> though it's technically a Windows font, it should still work in Mac
> OS X.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________________________________
> _
> _______________________________________________________________________
> _
>
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
>
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From: RSRICHMOND@aol.com
Date: 2004-05-21 01:09:00 #
Subject: Re: [shavian] Re: Republishing Shaw's Androcles and the Lion in America
Toggle Shavian
Craig notes: >>I really would prefer to see a facsimile reprinting, as the original font is really quite gorgeous.<<
I agree with Craig. But I'm not sure how a photographic reproduction of the text printed on paper, even from the library edition, would look. I suspect that re-setting it would look better.
Bob Richmond
Knoxville, Tennessee
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From: Joe
Date: 2004-05-21 06:18:56 #
Subject: [shavian] Re: Congratulations on a new and better Shavian font.
Toggle Shavian
--- In shavian@..., "paul vandenbrink" <pvandenbrink@s...> wrote:
> Thanks, Joe
> Above all for raising the priority on making this new font.
> Who needs a new piano anyway. A fixed-width Shavian font, is much
> more useful innovation.
> I really liked Shaw-Mono. Almost all the letters were more clearly
> differentiated in your format, and most of them looked better
> esthetically as well. I especially like your take on the Yea and the
> W letter. Normally they look a little out of place in most Shaw
> fonts, but here in your font, they fit right in.
Thanks for the support! I'm glad to know you like the font.
> So now let me quibble a little bit about the ones that I thought
> could be improved.
>
> 1. I like the new form for Urge/Err and Air. They remind me of Mayan
> Glyphs for some reason. But, unforunately they resemble each other
> too much. It is hard to distinguish them from each other, in the
> smaller point sizes. I didn't like the look of the "ar" letter, but
> all the other r-sound letters looked great.
It can be hard to squeeze the ligatures into the same space as all the other letters,
which is why I made them look the way they do. And it shouldn't be surprising that
they look the same, since I made Air by flipping Err upside down. This was mainly
just to fill in for the letter until I can make a new, more distinct one, which I'll be
working on, now.
> 2. Ian looks too much like a lower case "r" in T.O. But then I rarely
> use Ian anyway, so I can live with that.
It's just the shape of If + Ado. I thought it looked like "r" in all the other fonts,
anyway. I'll see what I can do, but like you, I can live with it for now.
> 3. The Up letter looks like typesetting error, top heavy or something.
It does, doesn't it? I struggled to balance that one, making the base wider without
making it look like a "z". I'll have to make the stem curve down more smoothly, away
from the top, more like a short "7"
> P.S. What is the new Shaw Character represented by pressing an upper
> case "L"?
> It looks nice but I didn't recognise what it is for.
Actually, it's a combination of /t/ and /d/. It's a letter I made and use in my own
notes to represent the -ed suffix where its pronunciation is predictable. But I don't
really use it much, so I may remove it from future versions unless anyone else wants
it.
I also need to work on the ampersand character (&). It's a bit rough, still.
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